2028 Ford Thunderbird: Should The Iconic T-Bird Rise From The Ashes As An EV?

I never understood why they did it to the mustang and not the already iconic thunderbird. Musk type advertising I guess, just annoy people so that people advertise it for you inadvertedly
 
Was at a grill out Last weekend and there was a "mustang" mach-e owner there. It came up that people don't want to call them mustangs as it's not a real Mustang. I chuckled to myself, and kept my mouth shut. He's totally the type to think it is a mustang.
At the end of the day Ford knows it can't sell enough coupes to sustain a pair of them. I don't know that it will change in the next few years. If they do a Thunderbird and make it super cutting edge and it happens to be EV, whatever. Just make it nice.
 
Give it a fatass V8 and let them have an arms race with corvette, and blatantly say they're challenging it again. Hopefully win this time.
 
Zep5.0 said:
He's totally the type to think it is a mustang.
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Yeah, but it still has a horse on the front end. 🤔

Just wait till you see the Corvette SUV. 😉 No different than the Porsche SUV, a Porsche is a Porsche. Just slap a logo on it, nostalgia is meaningless these days.

If they do make a Thunderbird EV, they could call it a Mach T - Bird. 🤣
 
I feel like it's all Karma directed at me for putting a junkyard hybrid emblem on my Cougar as a joke one time. The whole world's gone topsy turvy with car names ever since!
 
I think Ford should introduce a model that is literally called "T-Bird". Thunderbird is a strong, recognizable brand, but I think it rings dated with most people. T-Bird on the other hand is sort of hip sounding - even if you don't know what the T stands for. It's also a fitting compromise with today's obsession for alphanumeric names, though T-Bird actually means something. It could even expand to a model line: E-Bird, X-Bird, ...
 
Ford should do it like they've always done it with the successful relationship between the Bird & Mark series.
Start with building a well-done Mark IX coupe with a V8, like they did with the Mark VIII.
Then build the new Bird design off of that, but throttled back on the Lincoln excesses to reduce cost and simplify the car.

Just a good, solid V8 luxury sports coupe that's stylish, comfy, affordable, and has good performance...without the mistakes of the overpriced $40K+ Retro Bird. It doesn't have to be a sledgehammer going after the Vette (that's the Mustang's job)...just an affordable & powerful mallet that looks great, doesn't have all the electronics/digital BS, and isn't going to embarrass you when you step into it.

Part of what made the MN12 so good & long-lasting was its great design, simplicity, and economic servicing/maintenance. Cars need to go back to that, because all of the electronics, digital stuff, and connectivity that they're stuffing into cars today are sending the prices higher, isn't reliable long-term, and will be a high-cost maintenance nightmare beyond 5-years. Even with scarcer & scarcer parts availability, our old Birds are still rolling and looking great 30+ years later for a reason.
 
May as well call it the ChinaBird.
 
Zep5.0 said:
I could get on board with that but if it's bigger than a mustang we'd end up with a 4500# barge (some call them challengers😬)
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Or a 64 Thunderbird ;)

The crisp and carefully chiseled lines projected luxury and substance, and indeed: this latest Thunderbird weighed more than 4600 lbs at the curb
 
NEURO said:
Ford should do it like they've always done it with the successful relationship between the Bird & Mark series.
Start with building a well-done Mark IX coupe with a V8, like they did with the Mark VIII.
Then build the new Bird design off of that, but throttled back on the Lincoln excesses to reduce cost and simplify the car.

Just a good, solid V8 luxury sports coupe that's stylish, comfy, affordable, and has good performance...without the mistakes of the overpriced $40K+ Retro Bird. It doesn't have to be a sledgehammer going after the Vette (that's the Mustang's job)...just an affordable & powerful mallet that looks great, doesn't have all the electronics/digital BS, and isn't going to embarrass you when you step into it.

Part of what made the MN12 so good & long-lasting was its great design, simplicity, and economic servicing/maintenance. Cars need to go back to that, because all of the electronics, digital stuff, and connectivity that they're stuffing into cars today are sending the prices higher, isn't reliable long-term, and will be a high-cost maintenance nightmare beyond 5-years. Even with scarcer & scarcer parts availability, our old Birds are still rolling and looking great 30+ years later for a reason.
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It sure will be something to see what car owners are in for in 10 years when all the electronic stuff starts being a problem.
 
Dude, the 63 I had weighed in at 5500lbs. I bought a set of tires from idiots, and the radials they put on it died horribly in less than 20 miles; it shredded them. It wanted 6-ply bias type tires, like what comes on trucks. :)
I'm sure the 64 vert we had would have been even heavier. By the time I got it, the floorboards were 'lightened, and the rockers were going. It must have lived up north for a long while.
 
5500 sounds high but I wouldn't be surprised. What many people don't realize is those 60s Tbirds were unibody cars, not BOF, and since they were luxury models designed to be convertibles from the start they are way way way overengineered with thick steel so they wouldn't be flexible rattle traps like most cheaper unibody cars from the era (Falcon, Mustang et al).

That's part of the reason I like the 58-60s, they're unibody too but for whatever reason they're closer to MN12 weight - 3700-3800lbs, featherweights in comparison. Though probably over 4000 with the 430.
 
Vicinity said:
Give it a fatass V8 and let them have an arms race with corvette, and blatantly say they're challenging it again. Hopefully win this time.
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Wake up, dude. There is no money in further development of "fatass V8s".

Corvette went mid-engine and is now heavily competing with Porsche for the "old man buys a sports car market". What else will an older guy with money consider buying if their backs can handle it?

Within the next 5 years you'll see the last gas pony cars: Mustang is going all out with the GTD and their last gen Mustang, the Camaro is already dead, and Dodge will end the Challenger production by EOY 2023.

Dodge is already out the door with their Challenger EV in 2024.
Ford chose to make a crossover... but could repackage the platform as a Mustang or a Tbird.
Chevy's Camaro might go the crossover route OR stick with a traditional car by 2026. I think they'll follow the money and you'll see a Mustang MachE competitor.

P.S. I actually like the render in the article but I think Ford will cheap out too much on the car to make it compelling. I was not impressed with how cheap the last gen mustang felt inside after having it for a week as a rental last year.
 
gunn said:
Wake up, dude. There is no money in further development of "fatass V8s".

Corvette went mid-engine and is now heavily competing with Porsche for the "old man buys a sports car market". What else will an older guy with money consider buying if their backs can handle it?

Within the next 5 years you'll see the last gas pony cars: Mustang is going all out with the GTD and their last gen Mustang, the Camaro is already dead, and Dodge will end the Challenger production by EOY 2023.

Dodge is already out the door with their Challenger EV in 2024.
Ford chose to make a crossover... but could repackage the platform as a Mustang or a Tbird.
Chevy's Camaro might go the crossover route OR stick with a traditional car by 2026. I think they'll follow the money and you'll see a Mustang MachE competitor.

P.S. I actually like the render in the article but I think Ford will cheap out too much on the car to make it compelling. I was not impressed with how cheap the last gen mustang felt inside after having it for a week as a rental last year.
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The Pickup trucks are the only vehicles that US automakers sell at a profit and the Lightning is a flop, V8s aren't going anywhere. They may well be hybridized going forward to meet draconian CAFE targets but the V8 is not a dead concept.

The Crossover bodied EV with a cool name isn't proving to be a recipe for profit either, The Mach E is a money loser, if GM's smart they should look at the actual numbers and compute the fact that even with meager sales compared to the past the Mustang name has more broad appeal than the Camaro. Mustang has that Americana aura, Camaro is in the rhealm of gearheads, soccer moms don't give a shit about the name Camaro, and if they actually go through with another breadroll crossover EV watch them rot on the dealer lots.

The writing may well be on the wall for the ponycar market, but then again the Mustang was the only ponycar available 20 years ago too. It ebbs and flows. in the 70s the only one left standing was the Camaro and Firebird and the latter had a massive sales resurgence with its monopoly on the performance market, same will probably be true of the standard (real)Mustang. with the absence of its current rivals, the market will likely come to it and adequate sales will keep it in the stay of execution zone it was in the SN95 era, it doesn't need a new freaking platform every 5 years to keep its appeal(as the Chrysler LX showed)

But from what I've heard through the grapevine the Charger "EV" concept we saw last year, the that makes the fake "vroom vroom" noises, isn't going to be a strict EV for production, it's is going to be available in 2 door (effectively filling the challenger role) or 4 door with traditional V8 gas engines and with the EV as a top line option. Hellcat prospects seem low but I don't care about those kinds of numbers in a street car anyway.
 
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Vicinity said:
I never understood why they did it to the mustang and not the already iconic thunderbird. Musk type advertising I guess, just annoy people so that people advertise it for you inadvertedly
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They made Mustang a brand and added the machE to meet epa standards. Without a 100 mile per gallon equivalent averaged into the Mustang mix ford wouldn’t meet the 40mpg epa rating for I think 2024 or 2025 model year. So without it you’d see mustangs go the way of the Camaro challenger and charger. Into thin air.

Corvette is becoming its own brand also. The suv is ev and the e-ray is hybrid. Both making the corvette brand comply with the epa rating.
 
In the 60's, the base version was much the same as the high end version, thus the people renting the hurst /Hertz rentals, and swapping the drivetrain thing that happened wbw. :) I remember my 83 firebird fondly, but finding out the unibody was built differently than the v-8 cars was a drag. Thankfully ford didn't fuck us in that way, lol. Putting a v-8 in my base fb , with a manual, would twist the frame to where one of the front tire barely touched the ground. I almost bought that drivetrain, before I found out that was the problem. :) I ended up with Lazarus, and sold the fb to a local kid for his pocket contents, like $250, lol.
 
When I sold the 63, I traded it straight up for $600, and an ltd. :) The tbird was worn out, blown engine at 60k miles on the 3rd rebuild. The body had sideswiped a bridge, before my dad gave it to me, lol.
 
Trunk Monkey said:
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Man, that thing is hideous. I certainly don't see a Thunderbird there, of any stripe. I can't tell if it's a 2-seater or 4-seater, though it seems like it would be cramped with 4/5 people in there. It's hard to tell if that's the front or rear, feels very Porsche 914.

XR7-4.6 said:
But from what I've heard through the grapevine the Charger "EV" concept we saw last year, the that makes the fake "vroom vroom" noises, isn't going to be a strict EV for production, it's is going to be available in 2 door (effectively filling the challenger role) or 4 door with traditional V8 gas engines and with the EV as a top line option. Hellcat prospects seem low but I don't care about those kinds of numbers in a street car anyway.
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Holy shit, did Dodge finally figure out what a true Charger (mostly) looks like? 2 doors?!? Not 4, but 2?!? Thank Odin, better late than never. That is literally the first EV I've seen that I would actually want to own. The bits that I don't like (the goofy open nose gaps) aren't enough to make me hate it. It looks like they were smart enough to include an actual dashboard (in front of the driver) and not just a tablet glued to the center console area. When I look at that thing I see the car they say it is, unlike that mock Thunderbird EV.

In principle I hate the PA engine noises but, after having been snuck up by a few EVs because I couldn't even hear them approaching, I think it's cool as a safety feature. I'm sure it will help those people who don't realize how fast (or slow!) they're driving because they don't hear anything. I would just hope that there's the option to add different sounds from different years of Chargers with different engines. Including ones it never had like the 340. I would want an option on that hatchback that would put in the correct design Charger rear window (not fastback) with the flying buttresses. Maybe some 3rd party can make a replacement hatch? Too much to hope for, I bet.
 
rampagingsloth said:
Man, that thing is hideous. I certainly don't see a Thunderbird there, of any stripe. I can't tell if it's a 2-seater or 4-seater, though it seems like it would be cramped with 4/5 people in there. It's hard to tell if that's the front or rear, feels very Porsche 914.



Holy shit, did Dodge finally figure out what a true Charger (mostly) looks like? 2 doors?!? Not 4, but 2?!? Thank Odin, better late than never. That is literally the first EV I've seen that I would actually want to own. The bits that I don't like (the goofy open nose gaps) aren't enough to make me hate it. It looks like they were smart enough to include an actual dashboard (in front of the driver) and not just a tablet glued to the center console area. When I look at that thing I see the car they say it is, unlike that mock Thunderbird EV.

In principle I hate the PA engine noises but, after having been snuck up by a few EVs because I couldn't even hear them approaching, I think it's cool as a safety feature. I'm sure it will help those people who don't realize how fast (or slow!) they're driving because they don't hear anything. I would just hope that there's the option to add different sounds from different years of Chargers with different engines. Including ones it never had like the 340. I would want an option on that hatchback that would put in the correct design Charger rear window (not fastback) with the flying buttresses. Maybe some 3rd party can make a replacement hatch? Too much to hope for, I bet.
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In fairness the current Charger and Challenger would eat into each others sales and shrink the market if both were 2 doors, which is exactly why the 1970s E bodies were considered failures. The Charger was already dodge's "ponycar", a massive 117 wheelbase one but that was its role for Dodge in the 60s, the Challenger was redundant(and it too was still big for the segment). I still think the current gen Charger's styling is good in spite of the door count, it's a modern design with signature touches rather than a tracing paper retro design which I appreciate. I have as high regard for the 68-69 Charger as anyone(although the current pricing puts them into overrated territory for me now) but I also like the first and third gens quite a bit too. I even like the 69 500 with the buttresses filled in with a aero window plug(not a fan of the Coronet nose though)

I'll never relent on the fake engine noise not being totally and completely :BMW: are gearshifts going to be fake piped in too? Or is it one continuously progressing vvvvvvvvvvrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrooooooooooommmmmmmmmmm from 0-100mph? Either answer is stupid.

I don't care for the dead silence of EVs either but they're supposedly so futuristic, then make them sound futuristic!

 
A loud stereo, would make up for the lack of engine noise. What voltage are electric cars? You coud run a big assed amp directly off 480, lol. You can run 57kW into a 4 ohm load, lol. But imagine the engine whine from that, lol. My current amp draws 56A at 14.4, but it turns it into a much higher voltage to run the amp. Amps fail as much from the power supply section almost as often as the finals.
 
Gas prices in southern cali as of today. It’s off the side of the freeway but still, it’s getting rediculous out here .



IMG_4140.jpeg
 
My brother-in-law had a Chevy Volt until it got t-boned and the battery pack was destroyed. He only drove it about 50 miles a day during the work week and it almost never ran on the engine. Plugging it in every night spiked his power bill about $100 a month, and that was in 2019 before our electric costs spiked through the roof here.

In comparison, our Fusion Hybrid gets about 40mpg. If we ran it 50 miles a day every day, that's about $120 a month in gasoline at the current cost.

Personally, I'd rather pay the extra $20 in fuel than deal with the hassle of an EV.
 
I can't believe premium is only 20 cents more from regular, while its a full dollar more here.

I know I shouldn't complain since even with the extra dollar it's "only" $4.50 a gallon but it just goes to show how bullshit it all is. Supply and demand my ass, it's just trolls under the bridge.
 
Gas here ranges between $5 and $7 .. so it really depends where you go unless it doesn't come out of your pocket.
 
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