Newb...Howdy!

[Jamie]

Howdy all! To preface this intro, I'm 70. The last car I owned was a 1966 Ford Galaxie 427 and I scrapped it 1984. That is the only car I have ever owned. I am a biker, that is beat, battered and hammered into 220 pounds of carefully hammered shit. Now, after 40 years, the time has come for me to get a car. The cold has become unbearably painful for riding during the colder months.

I am fond of the lines of the MN12 Bird and I have learned some about them through my own research, but still lots to still learn...let me say right now....I am on SS, I am older, beat up and DO NOT work on cars! So, reliability is a THE major factor in choosing a car. I have found some 95 - 97 LX 4.6L that are in great almost new condition with less than 50K on the odo....and yes, I am aware that the odo can break, but a scan with the ODBC scanner can give me the accurate mileage . I am aware of the plastic intake issues of the 96/97.

The information I am looking for from you current owners is this.....expected component failure relating to any part of the car between the 50K and 100K mileage range that any of you have experienced...fuel pump, water pump, timing chain tensioners, tranny, electronics, ...any and all...no matter minor or major. Then I can analyze expected cost of ownership as it relates to my budget. I keep my bike in perfect condition and I did my prior car and would expect to do the same with whatever I purchase next. My expected annual mileage will be less than 3,000 miles a year as when the temps are about 70, I ride! So, let the games begin! Lets have your years, submodel, engine, tranny...,,and all failures listed please! TIA

 

[dDUBb]

The mileage is not stored in any PCM on these vehicles. You won't find that information on anything except a vehicle inspection report / dmv / smog, if the vehicle was submitted for inspection.

The only Major failure you may run into is the transmission; the later years (96/97) are less prone to failure.

 

[Jamie]

The mileage is not stored in any PCM on these vehicles. You won't find that information on anything except a vehicle inspection report / dmv / smog, if the vehicle was submitted for inspection.

The only Major failure you may run into is the transmission; the later years (96/97) are less prone to failure.

Thanks, ...I asked for all failures, minor or major...cause when you have to pay someone else to do the work, it becomes major.

 

[1997ThunderbirdLXV6]

I think the problem with asking for any and all failures is that a lot of them aren't specific to this platform.

For example, in 1.5 years owning my '97 V6, I had a faulty oxygen sensor, a faulty coil pack, issues with spark plug spacing, etc., all of which could occur with any car of this age.

I did observe a torque converter shudder for about a week, which was resolved by a fluid flush. This shudder is typical for this transmission (4R70W).

Other typical things...

• Sagging doors due to worn pins
• Weathered and/or peeling window trim
• LEDs failing in trunklid-mounted lights (Thunderbird only)
• Blend door failure
• Door insert cloth trim falling off
• ...

 

[Jamie]

Thank you...but why should it matter if it is specific to this platform...a failure is a failure...whether it be the windshield wiper motor or the blinker fluid dispenser...it is very simple question...please list any and all failures you have encountered between 50 and 100 thou miles....but if you need me to be more specific, then any 1989 - 1997 ford thunderbird with a 4.6L engine and an automatic transmission. Does that help? TIA!

 

[dDUBb]

Shit, I haven't owned a 4.6 Tbird with less than 100k miles since 1997.

 

[Stanley]

Because asking for any random thing that might have happened to one of the roughly 960,000 Thunderbirds ever built that happens to belong to, say, a rando in Manitoba is 1) asking the guy to put in work to meet your desires and 2) telling you nothing meaningful. That a guy named Bartholomew had to change his wiper arms once is not useful information. Only known-platform issues really matter, because there's a universal "whoops it broke" factor to any automobile ever made and that's additionally compounded with age--and these cars are old, mileage or not.

Your overwhelming desire for reliability ("THE major factor") and absolute refusal to put any work in on your ride, as understandable as the latter is, clashes strongly with your desire to get a 25-year-old personal luxury barge with a rapidly diminishing pool of available parts. You're trying to square a circle.

 

[Kenz]

IMO the biggest weak point for MN12s is the front end. They wear out quick and parts are getting hard to find. Mileage doesn't really matter in that regard. After a decade or even less the front end will be due for a total looking over and need servicing in some way. If you don't do the work yourself the bill for a shop to fix it will get expensive quick.

When I bought my Cougar I drove it for the first few years as a daily driver, it's a weekend car now and is at 86,000 miles. Back when it was my main car it was very reliable. When I got it, it basically just needed front end work - ball joints, control arms, a front bearing. I had to replace the EVAP system sensors and a few vac lines after a year. It had a no start issue once, but that was just the common bad connection at the crank sensor. Otherwise nothing major was needed.

 

[Grog6]

Most of the work I've had to do were mostly caused by my driving. Lazarus has gotten a set of control arms every 100k miles or so, new transmissions about the same interval, oil every 2500, New fluid when I change the trans, and then every 100k after that; I've put a total of900k miles on 3 cars, all 96/7 4.6's After you get the trans updated to the final configuration, you won't have any more problems. But, you will end up working on it.

Kenz hit it, lol. To go thru the front end is about $600, but the work is easy. and you need an alignment after.
After 28 years, the rubber bushings are either bad, or have been replaced. Even on a low mileage car.

 

[Jamie]

Because asking for any random thing that might have happened to one of the roughly 960,000 Thunderbirds ever built that happens to belong to, say, a rando in Manitoba is 1) asking the guy to put in work to meet your desires and 2) telling you nothing meaningful. That a guy named Bartholomew had to change his wiper arms once is not useful information. Only known-platform issues really matter, because there's a universal "whoops it broke" factor to any automobile ever made and that's additionally compounded with age--and these cars are old, mileage or not.

Your overwhelming desire for reliability ("THE major factor") and absolute refusal to put any work in on your ride, as understandable as the latter is, clashes strongly with your desire to get a 25-year-old personal luxury barge with a rapidly diminishing pool of available parts. You're trying to square a circle.

Are you daft? Did I say I wasn't willing to put in any work to a car? I said I wanted to know failures so I can analyze true cost of ownership. Did you read my original comment? I haven't owned a car, any car in over 40 ears....I have no idea how long a water pump last these days, or a fuel pump...there were no electric fuel pumps 40 years ago, or fuel injection or MAF's or lots of things found on car today. Put in work? Really, I can tell you off the top of my head exactly what parts on any of the bikes I have owned over the past 50 years failed, when, where, and what it cost to repair. If you wan to help, great, if not, your comment is worthless.

Most of the work I've had to do were mostly caused by my driving. Lazarus has gotten a set of control arms every 100k miles or so, new transmissions about the same interval, oil every 2500, New fluid when I change the trans, and then every 100k after that; I've put a total of900k miles on 3 cars, all 96/7 4.6's After you get the trans updated to the final configuration, you won't have any more problems. But, you will end up working on it.

Kenz hit it, lol. To go thru the front end is about $600, but the work is easy. and you need an alignment after.
After 28 years, the rubber bushings are either bad, or have been replaced. Even on a low mileage car.

Thank you....Useful info

 

[Jamie]

IMO the biggest weak point for MN12s is the front end. They wear out quick and parts are getting hard to find. Mileage doesn't really matter in that regard. After a decade or even less the front end will be due for a total looking over and need servicing in some way. If you don't do the work yourself the bill for a shop to fix it will get expensive quick.

When I bought my Cougar I drove it for the first few years as a daily driver, it's a weekend car now and is at 86,000 miles. Back when it was my main car it was very reliable. When I got it, it basically just needed front end work - ball joints, control arms, a front bearing. I had to replace the EVAP system sensors and a few vac lines after a year. It had a no start issue once, but that was just the common bad connection at the crank sensor. Otherwise nothing major was needed.

Thank you!

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Welcome Jamie.

 

[Grog6]

I drove my cars 120 miles a day, 5 days a week, at 70-140mph. Every day. I've thrown the Cougars into curves at 90, and they're solid as a rock.Luxo barge isn't where I'd classify it. I've made a curve at a speed a dodge viper Didn't make. He hit both sides of the bridge, at 135.

 

[Jamie]

I drove my cars 120 miles a day, 5 days a week, at 70-140mph. Every day. I've thrown the Cougars into curves at 90, and they're solid as a rock.Luxo barge isn't where I'd classify it. I've made a curve at a speed a dodge viper Didn't make. He hit both sides of the bridge, at 135.

hahah...ok....during that time, what part failures occurred for any reason other than self-inflicted damage?

 

[Stanley]

Are you daft? Did I say I wasn't willing to put in any work to a car?

...let me say right now....I am on SS, I am older, beat up and DO NOT work on cars!

I never said you weren't willing to have the car fixed up in any way shape or form: nobody thinks cars fix themselves, so there's an obvious assumption of service by someone else otherwise. I commented strictly on your request to have random people list everything that ever happened to their car between 50 and 100,000 miles of ownership ("all failures, major or minor" ... "any and all failures") while specifically scoffing at the idea of limiting yourself to platform-specific problems as if this approach was somehow going to give you useful information to work with, and the oddity of how reliability is "THE major factor" while considering a long-extinct platform you're not willing to work on yourself.

These are your words. Don't get huffy if people take you at them.

 

[Jamie]

Perhaps a further explanation of why I am asking all this is required for some of you that aren't familiar with pre-emptive MTBF maintenance. That means you know how long a part will last and you replace it before its expected lifespan ends. For example....if you know an alternator will last 40K miles, you replace it at 35K at your convenience, rather than take a chance of a impromptu failure on the road. The MTBF failure can be calculated on any part based on usage and/or miles....some things aren't worth knowing because it wont strand you, but those that can, you want to know and want to deal with it before it does. Most Americans are not familiar with this concept and don't or wont follow this type of regimen...but I do...and no vehicle has ever broke down on me and left me on the side of the road...not once in 55 years of driving/riding. So, this is why I want to pick your brains and take advantage of your real world experiences.

 

[Jamie]

I never said you weren't willing to have the car fixed up in any way shape or form: nobody thinks cars fix themselves, so there's an obvious assumption of service by someone else otherwise. I commented strictly on your request to have random people list everything that ever happened to their car between 50 and 100,000 miles of ownership ("all failures, major or minor" ... "any and all failures") while specifically scoffing at the idea of limiting yourself to platform-specific problems as if this approach was somehow going to give you useful information to work with, and the oddity of how reliability is "THE major factor" while considering a long-extinct platform you're not willing to work on yourself.

These are your words. Don't get huffy if people take you at them.

Fine...so, you A. aren't capable of providing any useful info and you only post to get your post count up. and B. others have provided useful info on this subject and you simply cant...got it! If that's all you have, your participation is no longer useful. Thank you.

 

[dDUBb]

 

[XR7-4.6]

I’ve had enough junk “premium” replacements for parts lately that I don’t subscribe to preventative maintenance unless it’s critical. My factory alternator for example lasted over 100k miles and the only reason I replaced it was because it didn’t fit the engine I swapped in. I can limp my car to the parts store to get a new one if it goes.

Stanley’s point isn’t off base, you’re going to get so many varying claims on this that you’re no better off than where you started as far as knowledge. A lot of this particular forum community modified their cars so who knows if what they replaced would have failed at 80k or 200k miles. Many subscribe to rebuilding the suspensions and brakes immediately upon purchase regardless of the state of condition, which has value since many suspension parts will potentially throw off the alignment when replaced and getting it all done at once saves a return trip and fee. That is more useful advice than a spreadsheet of anecdotal parts failures.

 

[Stanley]

Naw, I'm throwing in the towel. He's doing the same sort of thing in the TCCOA thread he made there; no point in arguing with the smartest guy in the room. I'm sure him discovering that a guy had his starter die in 98 that one time is going to be very helpful in his carefully crafted decision to buy a used car built back when Alanis Morissette was topping the charts because reliability is "THE major factor".

I think I'll do something productive instead, like interrogating random passersby over the fast food they had in 1986 so that I can create a healthy meal plan for myself (no I DO NOT cook).

 

[Grog6]

Exactly. My recommendation to anyone with these cars: If you aren't going to do a manual swap, get a good transmission guy to build you a transmission. Buy an aluminum driveshaft. Do the pbr swap. Decide on the mustang wheel swap before buying tires. Buy a set of Mustang Koni shocks for the rear, and whatever workaround we're using in the shocks thread. Mandrel bent systems true duals, in 2.5" size.

 

[Jamie]

I’ve had enough junk “premium” replacements for parts lately that I don’t subscribe to preventative maintenance unless it’s critical. My factory alternator for example lasted over 100k miles and the only reason I replaced it was because it didn’t fit the engine I swapped in. I can limp my car to the parts store to get a new one if it goes.

Stanley’s point isn’t off base, you’re going to get so many varying claims on this that you’re no better off than where you started as far as knowledge. A lot of this particular forum community modified their cars so who knows if what they replaced would have failed at 80k or 200k miles. Many subscribe to rebuilding the suspensions and brakes immediately upon purchase regardless of the state of condition, which has value since many suspension parts will potentially throw off the alignment when replaced and getting it all done at once saves a return trip and fee. That is more useful advice than a spreadsheet of anecdotal parts failures.

Perhaps, but my method has never left me stranded ever, so I will stick with it. MTBF on any car part is hard to calculate, but the more anecdotal info available to analyze, the closer I come to accuracy. Unfortunately, the part mfg's don't track that, so real world personal experiences is all that can be gleaned to build any type of useful(?) data. Your alternator for example...it lasted 100K...well, if you read my original post, you'll note that I haven't owned a car in over 40 years and alternators back then you were lucky to get 20K out of them. So, consider me a newly landed Martian with tremendous analytical skills trying to learn about the modern day car and the many aspects of reliability of its many components. I do know how to ask the right questions for the information I am seeking whether anyone else understands my reasoning or logic for doing so. You ask a million people if they would replace a working alternator because its expected lifespan is almost over and every one of them would look at you like you are crazy...Then ask them if they have sat on the side of the road waiting for a tow truck in 110 heat or 0 zero cold and a little light comes on in their head...so, whether I can get any info from the 16 members here, or need to go elsewhere, I will continue doing it my way. Those that understand my reasoning and want to offer useful info..., great! Those that dont...ok.

 

[theterminator93]

Want to see the T-bird's service history?

Approx. Date	Approx. Mileage	Description
11/2004	80,500	Vehicle purchase Flush automatic transmission Replace front lower ball joints Replace front left upper control arm Oil change
8/2007	90,000	Replace MAF sensor; Ford OE (NAPA remf’d)
6/2008	99,000	Replace right rear shock; NAPA Response Replace serpentine belt (NAPA)
8/2008	101,000	Oil change: Pitt-Penn 10W-30 conventional; Fram PH-2 filter
9/2008	102,000	Replace front brake rotors, pads Replace right rear brake rotor, pads
1/2009	106,000	Replace spark plugs; Autolite Platinum AP764 Sea Foam treatment thru gas tank and plenum Replace LR caliper; Ford OE (NAPA remf’d)
1/2009	106,500	Replace headlight bulbs; 3850K Halogen
1/2009	106,750	Replace four tires; Firehawk Indy 500 (215/70)
2/2009	107,000	Left door lock cylinder repaired Power antenna repaired
2/2009	107,250	Replace rear shocks; Monroe SensaTrac Replace front shocks/springs; Monroe Quick Strut (SensaTrac) Replace front right upper control arm/ball joint; Dorman
3/2009	108,250	Clean MAF sensor Replace air filter; Fram Oil change; Motorcraft 5W-30 synthetic blend; Fram PH-2 filter Replace spark plug wires; ACDelco Platinum Sea Foam treatment; thru gas tank and plenum
3/2009	108,500	Replace idler pulley; ACDelco Replace belt tensioner pulley; ACDelco
3/2009	109,000	Coolant system flush; Super Tech 50/50 Right door lock cylinder repaired Left door handle repaired
4/2009	109,250	Rear brake lines flushed; DOT-3
4/2009	109,500	Right door lock actuator replacement; Ford OE Automatic transmission fluid change; Valvoline MaxATF Rear differential fluid change; 80W-90 Power Steering system flush; Prestone P/S fluid
4/2009	109,750	Fog lamp installation Keyless entry remote programming New A/C low cycling switch (Santech) New Visteon A/C compressor Flush A/C lines/condenser/evaporator Replace A/C muffler line (used OEM)
5/2009	110,250	Replace RF brake rotor/pads, NAPA
5/2009	110,500	Rotate tires
5/2009	111,000	Replace LF wheel bearing (Timken)
6/2009	111,500	Replace Front sway bar endlinks (Motorcraft)
7/2009	112,000	RF rotor turned (warped) PI Intake manifold swap J-mod (mild; 1-2 springs in, 2-3 out) New trans. filter; Motorcraft, 1-2 & 2-3 accumulator pistons upgraded; Motorcraft
7/2009	112,500	EEC tuning for 93 octane fuel; Lonnie Doll 80mm ‘02 Mustang GT MAF sensor upgrade Replace LF UCA; Motorcraft Replace fuel filter; AutoZone
8/2009	112,750	Replace RF rotor; NAPA/Raybestos Tires balanced, rotated Replace alternator (from ’02 4.6 Explorer w/ 60,000 miles); new volt. regulator, 10% larger pulley
8/2009	113,000	Auxiliary transmission cooler install; B&M 70264 (post stock cooler; inline)
8/2009	113,500	Oil change; Valvoline MaxLife synthetic 5W30; Motorcraft 820S filter
10/2009	115,000	Tire rotation PI cam swap
10/2009	115,250	Replace original alternator, new volt. Regulator, new bearings, stock pulley
10/2009	115,250	LF rotor, brake pads replaced, NAPA
10/2009	115,500	HID projector headlight retrofit, 6000k
11/2009	115,750	Front O2 sensors replaced (Denso)
1/2010	118,000	New water pump, Spectra Premium
2/2010	118,750	PBR dual piston front caliper upgrade/line flush, Raybestos Advanced Technology ceramic pads, Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors
3/2010	120,000	Tire rotation Kenwood KDC-MP345U Head Unit install 4x Boston Acoustics S-85 Speakers install JVC KS-AX3002 amplifier install, bridged to sub Panasonic SB-W740 subwoofer install Replace A/C compressor clutch/pulley; NAPA
4/2010	120,500	Replace Radiator; Silla Oil change; Valvoline SynPower synthetic 10W30; Motorcraft 820S filter
4/2010	120,750	Dante replica Cobra R 17x9” rims, Firestone Firehawk Wide Oval 255/45 (summer tires) installed McGard locking lugs, code ------------------------ Power steering pump replaced, Motorcraft Rear brake lines replaced (splice at ½ point near frame rail/double flare fittings)
5/2010	122,000	Add oil; ½ Qt. Valvoline SynPower 10W30
10/2010	124,500	Replace drive shaft (’93 Mark VIII one-piece aluminum) Replace right halfshaft seal (Timken) POR-15 underbody paint application 2-1/2” mandrel bent dual exhaust install, Dynomax Super Turbo mufflers, Thunderbolt spun cats (Mandrel Exhaust Systems (TruBendz Technology))
12/2010	125,250	Drive shaft balanced (Henderson Drive Line/Axle) 3.73 traction-lok gears installed (New halfshaft seals – Timken, resealed rear cover, FRPP gears, Valvoline SynPower 75w-90 synthetic gear oil) 21-tooth speedometer gear installed
1/2011	125,250	Repair power antenna Install muffler tips, general exhaust install touch-up Replace EVAP system vacuum lines; purge flow sensor (BWD CP509)
2/2011	125,250	Oil Change (Valvoline SynPower 10W-30, Motorcraft FL-820S)
2/2011	125,250	Repair A/C recirculated/fresh air blend door
3/2011	125,250	Replace battery (850 CCA Autocraft Gold)
3/2011	125,500	Replace wiper arms (Michelin Stealth) Replace battery tray (Used OEM) Scangauge Plus installation
4/2011	125,500	Replace lower control arms (TRW) Replace strut rod bushings/control arm side (Motorcraft) Replace RF ABS sensor Repair HVAC inlet seal Wheel alignment (Firestone)
7/2011	127,500	Kenwood KDC-X595 head unit install
9/2011	128,250	Replace Multi-Function Switch (Motorcraft)
9/2011	128,750	Torque Converter Install (02 Mustang GT 11.25” OE; pink dot)
11/11/2011-3/6/2012	130,000	Body/rust repair, fresh paint (PPG 2 stage E9 Laser Red); Ed’s Auto Reconditioning Replacement LH door handle (Ford OE) Replacement RH door (1996 T-bird) Replacement RH fender (Mill Supply) Replace rusted/damaged sections of R/L rocker panels (Mill Supply) Replace Door lock, ignition lock cylinders (Ford OE, key code -----------) Upgrade fuel pump (Walbro 190 lph)
3/2012	130,000	Stereo Amplifier install (Sound Ordnance M-4075) Fold down rear seat back install (90 XR7) Modified instrument cluster install (stock w/ 97 Taurus SHO speedometer & Tach; SHO faces, rewired/repinned) Replace Serpentine Belt (Goodyear Gatorback)
3/2012	130,250	Underdrive Pulley installation (Steeda) Replace Water Pump (Motorcraft closed vane design) Oil change (Valvoline SynPower 5W-30, Purolator filter) Coolant System Flush (Prestone flush) New Coolant (Peak/Super Tech 50/50)
4/2012	130,250	Grind away/paint over floor pan, seat tracks rust (RustOleum hammered finish black) Shampoo interior carpet/upholstery New wheel lock nut
4/2012	130,500	Air filter cleaned/re-oiled
4/2012	131,000	Torque Converter Install (DirtyDog Performance 10” 3500 stall) Transmission Install (DirtyDog Performance rebuilt 2004 Mustang GT 4R70W; 72.5k original miles, new fluid stock ’97 repainted black with severely J-modded valve body) Replace Transmission Cooler lines (3/8” Aluminum) New transmission cooler (tiny, no idea what it is)
4/2012	131,000	Install illuminated cruise switches (95 Mark VIII clock spring, 04 Mach 1 steering wheel, 95 Mark VIII cruise switch faces/electrical, 96 Mustang horn switch/harness, stock air bag) 24#/hr. fuel injectors installed (Bosch type III) Don LaSota Tune programmed
5/2012	131,250	EGR tube replaced
6/2012	132,750	Crank sensor replaced (Motorcraft)
11/2012-3/2013	136,000	Replace heater hoses (Dayco) Replace radiator hoses (Dayco) Replace motor mounts (DEA) Replace oil filter adapter gasket (Fel-pro) Install PI heads (Stage 2 ported, Stage 3 +1mm valves, Nick McKinney @ Modular Head Shop) Install Stage 2P Cams (Bullet Cams) Replace front timing tensioners, guides, chains (Ford) Replace coolant Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W-20, FL820s filter) Replace oil drain plug (Motorcraft) Replace oil dipstick tube (Lokar) Replace valve cover gaskets (unknown) Replace shifter trim/indicator Replace IAC valve (Motorcraft) Replace spark plugs (Motorcraft 22C) Replace spark plug wires (Motorcraft 8mm) Install driver side head coolant mod Replace TPS (Motorcraft) Replace EGR vacuum solenoid (SMP) Replace fuel pressure regulator (SMP) Install 30#/hr fuel injectors (Bosch type 3) Install FR500 steering wheel Install new rear tires (Nitto NT555 255/50/17) Install new speedometer gear (Ford 20 tooth) Install illuminated headlight switch/trim (98 Mark VIII OEM donor, Radio Shack relays) Replace RH muffler hanger clamp Install stainless steel exhaust tips Replace EGR valve
5/2013	137,250	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W-30, FL820S) New transmission fluid cooler (B&M 70274) Replace ½ transmission fluid (Valvoline MaxATF)
7/2013	139,000	New subwoofer installed (JL 8W1V2-4 in factory 92-94 JBL enclosure; 14AWG speaker wire)
7/2013	139,500	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W-20, FL820S) Install ported FRPP 70mm Throttle Body (618jerrys) Install ported SN95 plenum (618jerrys) Clean instrument cluster contact terminals
10/2013	141,500	Replace Passenger headlight ballast (autoretrifit/ebay) Replace headlight bulbs (4300k, autoretrofit/ebay) Add oil (1 qt SynPower 10W-30)
3/2014	143,250	Replace battery (AutoCraft Gold – warranty exchange)
3/9/2015	148,250	Change oil (Valvoline 5W-20 synthetic, FL820s)
8/2015	149,500	Replace hood Replace F bumper cover Replace header panel Replace F headlights/reinstall projectors (OEM) Bleed brakes Install seat upholstery (SCP Deluxe leather)
9/23/2015	151,350	Replace spark plugs (Autolite APP103)
12/12/2015	152,850	Replace inner tie rods (Mevotech Supreme) Replace outer tie rods (TRW)
1-3/2016	152,850	Rebuild differential (Henderson Driveline – extra clutches, 80W90 Limited Slip Valvoline Conventional) New front differential bushings (Energy Suspension) New rear knuckle bushings (Energy Suspension) Install braided SS brake hose (RR)
4/12-14/16	152,850	Wheel alignment Install R sway bar links (Moog)
4/18/16	153,000	Replace ambient air temp. sensor (SMP)
2/18/17	155,750	Replace valve cover gaskets and grommets (Fel-Pro)
2/24/17	155,750	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W20 HM, FL820s)
3/2017	155,750	Front brakes replace/upgrade (13” SN95 style, Raybestos Advanced Technology calipers/rotors and reman. Cardone calipers) Remaining SS brake hoses installed
7/16/17	156,900	Switch upstream O2 sensor sides
7/20/17	157,050	Inject grease into both lower ball joint boots
2/20/18	157,231	Replace front lower control arms (TRW/Moog) Bleed master cylinder and brake lines
1-3/22/2018	157,231	Replace transmission (BC Automotive 4R70W: 2007 and 2004 hybrid– 7P direct, 6P forward, with drain plug) Replace torque converter (Circle D 245mm 3C) Flush transmission cooler New transmission fluid Replace 4 O2 sensors (NTK) Replace rear transmission mount (DEA)
5/26/18	158,200	Replace RF rotor (Raybestos AT) Reprogram PCM for 87 octane
6/13/18	158,250	Replace R UCA (Moog) Replace RF wheel bearing (Timken)
9/27/18	159,500	Replace radiator (Fluidyne Custom Aluminum)
3/18/19	159,800	Wheel alignment (Van’s auto service) Tires balanced (Van’s auto service)
3/26/19	160,150	Change oil (Valvoline MaxLife 5W30 blend, FL820s) Replace transmission dipstick O-ring
7/26/19	161,500	Replace rear tires (Nitto NT555 G2 255/50/17)
11/19-7/21/20	162,400	Replace rocker panels and treat corrosion (Chill’s Body Shop) Replace battery (Die Hard Gold)
8/18/20	163,380	Repair LR tire puncture
3/22/21	165,000	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower FS HM 5W30, FL820s)
6/12/21	166,250	Replace LH window regulator gear plugs (Dorman)
8/23/21	167,000	Replace F tires (Nitto NT555G2 255/45/17 – Sylvester)
10/20/21	168,000	Replace LH window regulator gear plugs (Dorman) Repair instrument cluster bezel
11/20/21	168,300	Install long tube headers (Dave Dalke; SN95 MACs modified by “General Zod”) Modify headers for EGR (Dave Dalke) Replace oil pan (OEM donor) Change oil (5W30)
12/5/21	168,500	Replace hood struts (“A-Premium” – Amazon)
3/2022	168,750	Replace valve cover gaskets (Victor Reinz) Replace intake manifold gaskets (Fel-pro) Re-plumb heater hoses (Gates) Change coolant
4/26/22	168,860	Replace spark plug wires (Motorcraft)
8/3/22	169,824	Replace brake light switch (Standard Motor)
1/13/23	171,400	Kenwood KDC-X998 head unit install
11/5/23	175,400	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower HM 5W30, FL820s)

 

[Jamie]

Want to see the T-bird's service history?

Approx. Date	Approx. Mileage	Description
11/2004	80,500	Vehicle purchase Flush automatic transmission Replace front lower ball joints Replace front left upper control arm Oil change
8/2007	90,000	Replace MAF sensor; Ford OE (NAPA remf’d)
6/2008	99,000	Replace right rear shock; NAPA Response Replace serpentine belt (NAPA)
8/2008	101,000	Oil change: Pitt-Penn 10W-30 conventional; Fram PH-2 filter
9/2008	102,000	Replace front brake rotors, pads Replace right rear brake rotor, pads
1/2009	106,000	Replace spark plugs; Autolite Platinum AP764 Sea Foam treatment thru gas tank and plenum Replace LR caliper; Ford OE (NAPA remf’d)
1/2009	106,500	Replace headlight bulbs; 3850K Halogen
1/2009	106,750	Replace four tires; Firehawk Indy 500 (215/70)
2/2009	107,000	Left door lock cylinder repaired Power antenna repaired
2/2009	107,250	Replace rear shocks; Monroe SensaTrac Replace front shocks/springs; Monroe Quick Strut (SensaTrac) Replace front right upper control arm/ball joint; Dorman
3/2009	108,250	Clean MAF sensor Replace air filter; Fram Oil change; Motorcraft 5W-30 synthetic blend; Fram PH-2 filter Replace spark plug wires; ACDelco Platinum Sea Foam treatment; thru gas tank and plenum
3/2009	108,500	Replace idler pulley; ACDelco Replace belt tensioner pulley; ACDelco
3/2009	109,000	Coolant system flush; Super Tech 50/50 Right door lock cylinder repaired Left door handle repaired
4/2009	109,250	Rear brake lines flushed; DOT-3
4/2009	109,500	Right door lock actuator replacement; Ford OE Automatic transmission fluid change; Valvoline MaxATF Rear differential fluid change; 80W-90 Power Steering system flush; Prestone P/S fluid
4/2009	109,750	Fog lamp installation Keyless entry remote programming New A/C low cycling switch (Santech) New Visteon A/C compressor Flush A/C lines/condenser/evaporator Replace A/C muffler line (used OEM)
5/2009	110,250	Replace RF brake rotor/pads, NAPA
5/2009	110,500	Rotate tires
5/2009	111,000	Replace LF wheel bearing (Timken)
6/2009	111,500	Replace Front sway bar endlinks (Motorcraft)
7/2009	112,000	RF rotor turned (warped) PI Intake manifold swap J-mod (mild; 1-2 springs in, 2-3 out) New trans. filter; Motorcraft, 1-2 & 2-3 accumulator pistons upgraded; Motorcraft
7/2009	112,500	EEC tuning for 93 octane fuel; Lonnie Doll 80mm ‘02 Mustang GT MAF sensor upgrade Replace LF UCA; Motorcraft Replace fuel filter; AutoZone
8/2009	112,750	Replace RF rotor; NAPA/Raybestos Tires balanced, rotated Replace alternator (from ’02 4.6 Explorer w/ 60,000 miles); new volt. regulator, 10% larger pulley
8/2009	113,000	Auxiliary transmission cooler install; B&M 70264 (post stock cooler; inline)
8/2009	113,500	Oil change; Valvoline MaxLife synthetic 5W30; Motorcraft 820S filter
10/2009	115,000	Tire rotation PI cam swap
10/2009	115,250	Replace original alternator, new volt. Regulator, new bearings, stock pulley
10/2009	115,250	LF rotor, brake pads replaced, NAPA
10/2009	115,500	HID projector headlight retrofit, 6000k
11/2009	115,750	Front O2 sensors replaced (Denso)
1/2010	118,000	New water pump, Spectra Premium
2/2010	118,750	PBR dual piston front caliper upgrade/line flush, Raybestos Advanced Technology ceramic pads, Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors
3/2010	120,000	Tire rotation Kenwood KDC-MP345U Head Unit install 4x Boston Acoustics S-85 Speakers install JVC KS-AX3002 amplifier install, bridged to sub Panasonic SB-W740 subwoofer install Replace A/C compressor clutch/pulley; NAPA
4/2010	120,500	Replace Radiator; Silla Oil change; Valvoline SynPower synthetic 10W30; Motorcraft 820S filter
4/2010	120,750	Dante replica Cobra R 17x9” rims, Firestone Firehawk Wide Oval 255/45 (summer tires) installed McGard locking lugs, code ------------------------ Power steering pump replaced, Motorcraft Rear brake lines replaced (splice at ½ point near frame rail/double flare fittings)
5/2010	122,000	Add oil; ½ Qt. Valvoline SynPower 10W30
10/2010	124,500	Replace drive shaft (’93 Mark VIII one-piece aluminum) Replace right halfshaft seal (Timken) POR-15 underbody paint application 2-1/2” mandrel bent dual exhaust install, Dynomax Super Turbo mufflers, Thunderbolt spun cats (Mandrel Exhaust Systems (TruBendz Technology))
12/2010	125,250	Drive shaft balanced (Henderson Drive Line/Axle) 3.73 traction-lok gears installed (New halfshaft seals – Timken, resealed rear cover, FRPP gears, Valvoline SynPower 75w-90 synthetic gear oil) 21-tooth speedometer gear installed
1/2011	125,250	Repair power antenna Install muffler tips, general exhaust install touch-up Replace EVAP system vacuum lines; purge flow sensor (BWD CP509)
2/2011	125,250	Oil Change (Valvoline SynPower 10W-30, Motorcraft FL-820S)
2/2011	125,250	Repair A/C recirculated/fresh air blend door
3/2011	125,250	Replace battery (850 CCA Autocraft Gold)
3/2011	125,500	Replace wiper arms (Michelin Stealth) Replace battery tray (Used OEM) Scangauge Plus installation
4/2011	125,500	Replace lower control arms (TRW) Replace strut rod bushings/control arm side (Motorcraft) Replace RF ABS sensor Repair HVAC inlet seal Wheel alignment (Firestone)
7/2011	127,500	Kenwood KDC-X595 head unit install
9/2011	128,250	Replace Multi-Function Switch (Motorcraft)
9/2011	128,750	Torque Converter Install (02 Mustang GT 11.25” OE; pink dot)
11/11/2011-3/6/2012	130,000	Body/rust repair, fresh paint (PPG 2 stage E9 Laser Red); Ed’s Auto Reconditioning Replacement LH door handle (Ford OE) Replacement RH door (1996 T-bird) Replacement RH fender (Mill Supply) Replace rusted/damaged sections of R/L rocker panels (Mill Supply) Replace Door lock, ignition lock cylinders (Ford OE, key code -----------) Upgrade fuel pump (Walbro 190 lph)
3/2012	130,000	Stereo Amplifier install (Sound Ordnance M-4075) Fold down rear seat back install (90 XR7) Modified instrument cluster install (stock w/ 97 Taurus SHO speedometer & Tach; SHO faces, rewired/repinned) Replace Serpentine Belt (Goodyear Gatorback)
3/2012	130,250	Underdrive Pulley installation (Steeda) Replace Water Pump (Motorcraft closed vane design) Oil change (Valvoline SynPower 5W-30, Purolator filter) Coolant System Flush (Prestone flush) New Coolant (Peak/Super Tech 50/50)
4/2012	130,250	Grind away/paint over floor pan, seat tracks rust (RustOleum hammered finish black) Shampoo interior carpet/upholstery New wheel lock nut
4/2012	130,500	Air filter cleaned/re-oiled
4/2012	131,000	Torque Converter Install (DirtyDog Performance 10” 3500 stall) Transmission Install (DirtyDog Performance rebuilt 2004 Mustang GT 4R70W; 72.5k original miles, new fluid stock ’97 repainted black with severely J-modded valve body) Replace Transmission Cooler lines (3/8” Aluminum) New transmission cooler (tiny, no idea what it is)
4/2012	131,000	Install illuminated cruise switches (95 Mark VIII clock spring, 04 Mach 1 steering wheel, 95 Mark VIII cruise switch faces/electrical, 96 Mustang horn switch/harness, stock air bag) 24#/hr. fuel injectors installed (Bosch type III) Don LaSota Tune programmed
5/2012	131,250	EGR tube replaced
6/2012	132,750	Crank sensor replaced (Motorcraft)
11/2012-3/2013	136,000	Replace heater hoses (Dayco) Replace radiator hoses (Dayco) Replace motor mounts (DEA) Replace oil filter adapter gasket (Fel-pro) Install PI heads (Stage 2 ported, Stage 3 +1mm valves, Nick McKinney @ Modular Head Shop) Install Stage 2P Cams (Bullet Cams) Replace front timing tensioners, guides, chains (Ford) Replace coolant Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W-20, FL820s filter) Replace oil drain plug (Motorcraft) Replace oil dipstick tube (Lokar) Replace valve cover gaskets (unknown) Replace shifter trim/indicator Replace IAC valve (Motorcraft) Replace spark plugs (Motorcraft 22C) Replace spark plug wires (Motorcraft 8mm) Install driver side head coolant mod Replace TPS (Motorcraft) Replace EGR vacuum solenoid (SMP) Replace fuel pressure regulator (SMP) Install 30#/hr fuel injectors (Bosch type 3) Install FR500 steering wheel Install new rear tires (Nitto NT555 255/50/17) Install new speedometer gear (Ford 20 tooth) Install illuminated headlight switch/trim (98 Mark VIII OEM donor, Radio Shack relays) Replace RH muffler hanger clamp Install stainless steel exhaust tips Replace EGR valve
5/2013	137,250	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W-30, FL820S) New transmission fluid cooler (B&M 70274) Replace ½ transmission fluid (Valvoline MaxATF)
7/2013	139,000	New subwoofer installed (JL 8W1V2-4 in factory 92-94 JBL enclosure; 14AWG speaker wire)
7/2013	139,500	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W-20, FL820S) Install ported FRPP 70mm Throttle Body (618jerrys) Install ported SN95 plenum (618jerrys) Clean instrument cluster contact terminals
10/2013	141,500	Replace Passenger headlight ballast (autoretrifit/ebay) Replace headlight bulbs (4300k, autoretrofit/ebay) Add oil (1 qt SynPower 10W-30)
3/2014	143,250	Replace battery (AutoCraft Gold – warranty exchange)
3/9/2015	148,250	Change oil (Valvoline 5W-20 synthetic, FL820s)
8/2015	149,500	Replace hood Replace F bumper cover Replace header panel Replace F headlights/reinstall projectors (OEM) Bleed brakes Install seat upholstery (SCP Deluxe leather)
9/23/2015	151,350	Replace spark plugs (Autolite APP103)
12/12/2015	152,850	Replace inner tie rods (Mevotech Supreme) Replace outer tie rods (TRW)
1-3/2016	152,850	Rebuild differential (Henderson Driveline – extra clutches, 80W90 Limited Slip Valvoline Conventional) New front differential bushings (Energy Suspension) New rear knuckle bushings (Energy Suspension) Install braided SS brake hose (RR)
4/12-14/16	152,850	Wheel alignment Install R sway bar links (Moog)
4/18/16	153,000	Replace ambient air temp. sensor (SMP)
2/18/17	155,750	Replace valve cover gaskets and grommets (Fel-Pro)
2/24/17	155,750	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower 5W20 HM, FL820s)
3/2017	155,750	Front brakes replace/upgrade (13” SN95 style, Raybestos Advanced Technology calipers/rotors and reman. Cardone calipers) Remaining SS brake hoses installed
7/16/17	156,900	Switch upstream O2 sensor sides
7/20/17	157,050	Inject grease into both lower ball joint boots
2/20/18	157,231	Replace front lower control arms (TRW/Moog) Bleed master cylinder and brake lines
1-3/22/2018	157,231	Replace transmission (BC Automotive 4R70W: 2007 and 2004 hybrid– 7P direct, 6P forward, with drain plug) Replace torque converter (Circle D 245mm 3C) Flush transmission cooler New transmission fluid Replace 4 O2 sensors (NTK) Replace rear transmission mount (DEA)
5/26/18	158,200	Replace RF rotor (Raybestos AT) Reprogram PCM for 87 octane
6/13/18	158,250	Replace R UCA (Moog) Replace RF wheel bearing (Timken)
9/27/18	159,500	Replace radiator (Fluidyne Custom Aluminum)
3/18/19	159,800	Wheel alignment (Van’s auto service) Tires balanced (Van’s auto service)
3/26/19	160,150	Change oil (Valvoline MaxLife 5W30 blend, FL820s) Replace transmission dipstick O-ring
7/26/19	161,500	Replace rear tires (Nitto NT555 G2 255/50/17)
11/19-7/21/20	162,400	Replace rocker panels and treat corrosion (Chill’s Body Shop) Replace battery (Die Hard Gold)
8/18/20	163,380	Repair LR tire puncture
3/22/21	165,000	Change oil (Valvoline SynPower FS HM 5W30, FL820s)
6/12/21	166,250	Replace LH window regulator gear plugs (Dorman)
8/23/21	167,000	Replace F tires (Nitto NT555G2 255/45/17 – Sylvester)
10/20/21	168,000	Replace LH window regulator gear plugs (Dorman) Repair instrument cluster bezel
11/20/21	168,300	Install long tube headers (Dave Dalke; SN95 MACs modified by “General Zod”) Modify headers for EGR (Dave Dalke) Replace oil pan (OEM donor) Change oil (5W30)
12/5/21	168,500	Replace hood struts (“A-Premium” – Amazon)
3/2022	168,750	Replace valve cover gaskets (Victor Reinz) Replace intake manifold gaskets (Fel-pro) Re-plumb heater hoses (Gates) Change coolant
4/26/22	168,860	Replace spark plug wires (Motorcraft)
8/3/22	169,824	Replace brake light switch (Standard Motor)
1/13/23	171,400	Kenwood KDC-X998 head unit install

Thats wonderful! Thanks! Great record keeping!

 

[XR7-4.6]

Perhaps, but my method has never left me stranded ever, so I will stick with it. MTBF on any car part is hard to calculate, but the more anecdotal info available to analyze, the closer I come to accuracy. Unfortunately, the part mfg's don't track that, so real world personal experiences is all that can be gleaned to build any type of useful(?) data. Your alternator for example...it lasted 100K...well, if you read my original post, you'll note that I haven't owned a car in over 40 years and alternators back then you were lucky to get 20K out of them. So, consider me a newly landed Martian with tremendous analytical skills trying to learn about the modern day car and the many aspects of reliability of its many components. I do know how to ask the right questions for the information I am seeking whether anyone else understands my reasoning or logic for doing so. You ask a million people if they would replace a working alternator because its expected lifespan is almost over and every one of them would look at you like you are crazy...Then ask them if they have sat on the side of the road waiting for a tow truck in 110 heat or 0 zero cold and a little light comes on in their head...so, whether I can get any info from the 16 members here, or need to go elsewhere, I will continue doing it my way. Those that understand my reasoning and want to offer useful info..., great! Those that dont...

Well you’re going to find a lot of overlap with the 16 people here and 10 people over there and 18 people elsewhere.

Expected lifespan isn’t as easily quantifiable as how many miles are on it. Age, climate, maintenance, all add or subtract to longevity by huge amounts. Any component with rubber for example you can presume probably needs replacement to work optimally after 30 years whether there’s 20k on the clock or 200k. Mechanics, professional and amateur sometimes throw parts at a problem unnecessarily, sometimes a part needlessly replaced was replaced with an inferior quality one unbeknownst to the current owner - for example, say I bought my 60k mile car and the dealer I got it from rebuilt the front suspension with economy grade components and they all were worn out by 70k miles, my information wouldn’t be very useful or accurate.

Likewise I haven’t ever been stranded. Most failures give hints well before it happens so I just pay attention and look at/fix it as it comes. If I was really all that concerned I wouldn’t buy a 30 year old car and instead buy something new with a warranty.

 

[theterminator93]

I've been stranded three times.

First time was in the T-bird, back in spring of 2008, no way to detect or know it was coming. It was a short in the wire harness at the back of the engine near the upstream O2s. Car was cruising along fine then BAM - nothing. It was just like I shut the key off while on the road. Had to push it home.

Second time was completely avoidable, but I decided to chance it. The 96 Mark had spun a rod bearing at 186.5k and I was prepared to sell/scrap the car when another member offered to swap in a NOS engine for $500. Rather than trailer it I decided to try and drive it. Engine lost all oil pressure about 1/3 of the way there, and I shut it off and coasted to the shoulder on the freeway. When we got there with the trailer the next day I tried driving it up onto the trailer but the engine seized and vented the block as I was pulling it up the ramps.

Third time was also in the 96 Mark VIII, winter of 2015. This one I could have avoided had I recognized the warning signs - it was running rough sometimes (usually after starting it cold). Then one day it started up then died immediately. Fuel pump seized up at 192k.

The current Mark VIII hasn't had any mechanical issues - engine is all original, but I did get the trans rebuilt this year (proactively, recognizing the warning signs - slow to engage 1st when cold). Otherwise all the parts replacements on it have been consumables (fluids, suspension components).

 

[Jamie]

Well you’re going to find a lot of overlap with the 16 people here and 10 people over there and 18 people elsewhere.

Expected lifespan isn’t as easily quantifiable as how many miles are on it. Age, climate, maintenance, all add or subtract to longevity by huge amounts. Any component with rubber for example you can presume probably needs replacement to work optimally after 30 years whether there’s 20k on the clock or 200k. Mechanics, professional and amateur sometimes throw parts at a problem unnecessarily, sometimes a part needlessly replaced was replaced with an inferior quality one unbeknownst to the current owner - for example, say I bought my 60k mile car and the dealer I got it from rebuilt the front suspension with economy grade components and they all were worn out by 70k miles, my information wouldn’t be very useful or accurate.

Likewise I haven’t ever been stranded. Most failures give hints well before it happens so I just pay attention and look at/fix it as it comes. If I was really all that concerned I wouldn’t buy a 30 year old car and instead buy something new with a warranty.

I understand there are many factors that affect MTFB, and that is why I ask for yea model, mileage as well and I can glean some info by looking at the profile of the poster and seeing the environment they live. Every tidbit of info is useful to one degree or another. Driving style matters as well.. City stop and go vs lots of freeway, corner carver, or drag racer or grocery getter.....all this can paint a picture.

 

[Jamie]

I've been stranded twice.

First time was in the T-bird, back in spring of 2008, no way to detect or know it was coming. It was a short in the wire harness at the back of the engine near the upstream O2s. Car was cruising along fine then BAM - nothing. It was just like I shut the key off while on the road. Had to push it home.

Second time was in the 96 Mark VIII, winter of 2015. This one I could have avoided had I recognized the warning signs - it was running rough sometimes (usually after starting it cold). Then one day it started up then died immediately. Fuel pump seized up.

Yup...shit happens! Always can and does. However, it can be minimized to a degree that can be tolerable. Can never be completely eliminated tho. Murphy lives!

 

[dDUBb]

I bought my 94 5 speed SC in 2005 with 200k miles and a cracked oil pan / rod knock. I rebuilt the engine, replaced the alternator and I had one issue with the ignition circuit. Also the stereo stopped working. Other than that, it still has the original shocks / suspension and the same brakes that came on the car when I bought it.

 

[Jamie]

I bought my 94 5 speed SC in 2005 with 200k miles and a cracked oil pan / rod knock. I rebuilt the engine, replaced the alternator and I had one issue with the ignition circuit. Also the stereo stopped working. Other than that, it still has the original shocks / suspension and the same brakes that came on the car when I bought it.

Damn! Well, I wont be buying a 200K car or rebuilding any engines. Kinda wanting to keep to a 50-100K mile range