The Unofficial "Ask a Stupid Question" Thread

1997ThunderbirdLXV6 said:
I saw them once in the junkyard, and first I thought ka-ching! Then at the attempt of removal, the glass just fell off the unit, the inside of which had discolorations all over. Ultimately I decided they weren't worth the time and effort of repair.
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That version never seemed to be in demand even when they were new, I honestly don’t know what the manufacturer was thinking because besides the lack of reflector almost every detail on the lenses of the OEM and Depo clear corners was omitted, namely the lines molded into the lens. Worse yet the edge where the gasket sits under had a weird silvery paint in the shape of the non existent reflector and since it still used the chrome bulb mask it stood out like a sore thumb from the side. Paired with the headlights they looked mismatched. Maybe they intended to manufacture aftermarket headlights to match at one time but be it as it was when they hit the market it was kind of bizarre.

Here’s a very aged one on eBay for $29, it’s been there for a while

www.ebay.com

94-97 Ford Thunderbird Passenger Right Front Corner Signal Parking Light | eBay

1996 Ford Thunderbird 3.8 Auto White / Blue1FALP6241TH121000.
www.ebay.com

Gives you an idea of the quality too
 
Another dumb question, I know it is not the mn-12 platform, but does anyone know what years the fila thunderbird was produced.
 
Can't say for certain, but by some Googling, it looks to be 83 - 85?
 
CDsDontBurn said:
There's this one too. It's not the pair, just the passenger side.

www.ebay.com

Passenger Right OEM Corner Park Light Lamp turn Signal 96-97 COUGAR Thunderbird | eBay

THUNDERBIRD 96-97 Park Lamp-Turn Signal; (outer headlamp mounted). COUGAR 96-97 Park Lamp-Turn Signal; (outer headlamp mounted). See pictures.
www.ebay.com
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BTW just to twist the knife a little these were $30 shipped on eBay for the PAIR brand new in box for the longest time!

Weirdly they were actually cheaper even than the 89-95 clear corners
 
1997ThunderbirdLXV6 said:
Is this wiggle normal? Only the driver's side does it.

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Ya know you piqued my curiosity, and I just so happened to have a pair of the hinges in a cabinet because of course I do and just so happened as I walked by it scrolling on my phone lol

Here’s the driver (bottom)and passenger (top) side mirror imaging each other. Notice something different?

IMG_5967.jpeg


Besides the sawdust! 😆

Me thinks that spring is specifically there to keep the passenger seatback from rattling on the inertia stop when passengers aren’t occupying the seat. The driver seat doesn’t use it because the driver would always be sitting in it keeping the seat upright anyway. It’s a mix of beancounting engineering and NVH engineering, neat!

And that’s the reason it’s more slack on the driver side, the spring keeps the lever under tension at all times where on the driver side when the seatback is forward it’s essentially free to move in its necessary tolerances. It’s nothing to worry about; When the seatback is sitting against it(and you’re back is sitting against the seatback) you’re loading up that lever where it won’t rattle, as if it had its own spring.
 
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Does anyone know the dimensions (inner diameter) of the PCV hose directly on the valve?

Mine is extremely brittle, and I think it doesn't form a tight seal on the valve.
 
...ok, I think I narrowed it down to 3/8" inside diameter.

But is it OK to use a TOC (transmission oil cooler) hose for the PCV valve? Autozone had TOC hose only, sold by the foot.
 
Grog6 said:
When I have a bad one somewhere,I go thru and check all of them, unless they were replaced;all are the same age.
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True true.

I actually also changed the one that goes from the left valve cover to the air intake, whatever that may be. That hose's surface actually turned to dust at any touch.
 
I have a stupid question... on the 3.8l V6, does it use a 180 or 195 t-stat? I read it uses both and did not find an answer in the service manual.
 
Thanks Mikey... I was reading an article last night about running rich and someone had said that using a 180 may not let the engine warm up enough and could cause the engine to run rich, causing the O2 codes I am getting. I recall years ago that someone wrote a post that you should use a 180 and the 192 on the V6 was too hot or some BS like that. I think I have a 180 now in it, runs at 1/4 on the temp gauge all the time once warm. I have a 197 Motorcraft t-stat dying to be put in one of the cars (figuratively speaking). It will get up to mid-way running the A/C on a hot day, but never gets above that. And of course, the fan has already kicked in at that temp.
 
On my V6, thermostat presumably still the factory unit (?), when at normal operating temperature, the cluster gauge is at the center, sometimes just below the center, sometimes just above the center (fan turns on).

Reading the engine temperature with my scan tool app, that equates to a range of (appropriately, speaking from memory) 195° to 208°. I've seen as high as 215° going 75 mph uphill.

I don't see the point of a 180° thermostat. If anything, it would delay the engine from reaching proper operating temperature, no?
 
The engine will start switching the O2s in closed loop at a relatively low temperature of about 160F (IIRC, or if the engine has been running for a predetermined amount of time regardless of temp - whichever occurs first), so you can run a lower temp T-stat if desired with no real ill effects. However, unless you get a tune to adjust the fan speeds to turn on 15-20F lower than in the factory program, it won't really offer any real benefits unless you're cruising with constant airflow over the radiator.
 
theterminator93 said:
The engine will start switching the O2s in closed loop at a relatively low temperature of about 160F (IIRC, or if the engine has been running for a predetermined amount of time regardless of temp - whichever occurs first), so you can run a lower temp T-stat if desired with no real ill effects. However, unless you get a tune to adjust the fan speeds to turn on 15-20F lower than in the factory program, it won't really offer any real benefits unless you're cruising with constant airflow over the radiator.
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Good info. And in the back of my mind, I was thinking the same thing that the O2's are in closed loop at a low speed (just as the engine is warming up). And replacing the t-stat on the V6 is a PITA.
 
I can look up the exact logic the PCM uses for switching to closed loop if you want, but generally speaking, the PCM waits xx seconds before switching to closed loop (to let the O2s heat up). As the engine startup temp gets colder, that delay time increases. If the startup temp is close to running temp, there is virtually no delay before switching to closed loop.

For example, if the engine is 0 degrees at startup, it will take a few minutes before the PCM switches to closed loop - even if the engine is still only 30 or 40 degrees when it switches. If the startup temp is 180, it will switch to closed loop in a few seconds.

While the car is running in open loop when cold, the AFR is enriched as the engine warms (to offer more stable combustion at colder temps). This is also a reason why they have longer closed loop delays based on colder startup temp, as as soon as the car switches to closed loop it runs at stoich.
 
The main reason for switching to a colder thermostat is to give yourself a little head room before overheating. If you are in a hot climate, or you are towing or putting other heavy loads on the engine, having the cooler thermostat can help keep the engine temps lower, assuming the cooling fan is set to come on earlier as well. There is also a slight performance benefit, but not enough that you would ever notice on a 3.8NA.
 
theterminator93 said:
I can look up the exact logic the PCM uses for switching to closed loop if you want, but generally speaking, the PCM waits xx seconds before switching to closed loop (to let the O2s heat up). As the engine startup temp gets colder, that delay time increases. If the startup temp is close to running temp, there is virtually no delay before switching to closed loop.

For example, if the engine is 0 degrees at startup, it will take a few minutes before the PCM switches to closed loop - even if the engine is still only 30 or 40 degrees when it switches. If the startup temp is 180, it will switch to closed loop in a few seconds.

While the car is running in open loop when cold, the AFR is enriched as the engine warms (to offer more stable combustion at colder temps). This is also a reason why they have longer closed loop delays based on colder startup temp, as as soon as the car switches to closed loop it runs at stoich.
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Well, I obviously have a component that is acting up, whether it be the MAF, IAC, injectors or whatever the PCM is checking that is causing the O2's to register rich fuel flow. I checked my MAF last night and it looks, well... clean and ... frack who knows. I will need to look up how to test if the MAF is working correctly and run that test. I have some extra IAC's and TPS's I can use to see if those are causing issues as well. As mentioned under the O2 post, I can check the injectors with a NOID light, as well as idle to the injectors. There really is no reason this car is showing these codes other than a part is failing or I have a vacuum leak (which I have tested with brake cleaner) or the PCM is an issue (which it rarely is the PCM).
 
MadMikeyL said:
The main reason for switching to a colder thermostat is to give yourself a little head room before overheating. If you are in a hot climate, or you are towing or putting other heavy loads on the engine, having the cooler thermostat can help keep the engine temps lower, assuming the cooling fan is set to come on earlier as well. There is also a slight performance benefit, but not enough that you would ever notice on a 3.8NA.
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And New Mexico sure has a hot climate! But as mentioned, it does not warrant a 180 t-stat.
 
1997ThunderbirdLXV6 said:
Reminds me of @Rodeo Joe 's camshaft code, when he replaced several components without success, and ultimately the PCM was the culprit.

@White Lincoln , if you can locate a spare PCM, I would definitely test that! Unfortunately my spare ('97) wouldn't work I suppose.
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I HAVE ONE!!!! It is the OEM PCM from the car. It's in my shed in a box. And yes, I was contemplating replacing that as it was the last thing I have not swapped or swapped back.

But... OMG what a PITA to replace. Worth it if it fixes the issue of a wacky car.
 
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