Where in the hell are the washers?

Kidd-7 said:
If you alignment was off before this adventure that could affect how you felt the steering.
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i think they have done a front end alignment every time they have had to replace the front bushings and now both sets, but i cannot disagree.

Could a poor alignment cause a "healthy" joint to pop, but then disappear when aligned correctly? I would say one of my control arm-strut rod bushing was already deteriorating (my fault.... torched it on accident trying to get inlinks off), and i constantly had issues with the front strut rod bushings.

When i brought up the issue to the shop they said they pulled and pried and couldnt find anything, so all i could think of was the strut rod bushings ive had issues with countless times over. Anyways its the same shop that has probably installed things incorrectly numerous times.

but i agree, i just cant find anything obvious other than the strut rod bushings until now and neither can they apparently. so probably a ball joint that is hiding its face or poor alignment.
 
Is the car lowered? Geometry can change, although these cars seem to do really well with 1.5” lowered.
 
Kidd-7 said:
Is the car lowered? Geometry can change, although these cars seem to do really well with 1.5” lowered.
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well it is technically not lowered, but the fcs replacement shocks came with their own springs and seem to sit slightly lower

edit: also well technically shorter tires. so yes its lowered about an inch maybe but doesnt look like it with the wheel gap
 
well i have been stumped again. Binding/popping is back. On tight turns something pops out of place and then the pop when braking comes back until whatever is bound up returns and then it drives normally again.

I rambled a bit about this in the chat box but thought i should update that it is still infact not fixed. everything is assembled right now by the looks of it and i have no idea what is binding aside from maybe the lower arms or the strut rods again. i would hope not though

 
LukesCougar said:
well i have been stumped again. Binding/popping is back. On tight turns something pops out of place and then the pop when braking comes back until whatever is bound up returns and then it drives normally again.

I rambled a bit about this in the chat box but thought i should update that it is still infact not fixed. everything is assembled right now by the looks of it and i have no idea what is binding aside from maybe the lower arms or the strut rods again. i would hope not though

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Sway bar end links pop like that when turning if they’re bad. I’d replace those.

They look like crap in your photos. I’d say that’s where your problem is, Edit: Actually, the photo I was looking at is CD’s car. But check them on your car.

Looking at your video that might be the brakes but I have no idea why.

IMG_6272.jpeg
 
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The only thing up here that hasn't been replaced in the last year is the tie rod ends/ inner rods, sway bar bushings. The links while dirty still have their boots and were replaced recently, but I'll take them off and see if the binding goes away.
 
Also im not sure how much side to side play is normal, i cant get the tie rod ends to pop prying or wiggling but i can wiggle the wheel a little on both sides. edit: drivers and passenger side. No up and down play


i look so goofy doing this lol
 
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If you have help look closely at the outer / inner tie rods and the rack bushings while the help wiggles the tire. My rack bushings were so bad the rack shifted laterally about a1/8 inch.
 
I bumped a curb doing a 3-point turn a few years ago, and it exploded those bushings. I didn't bump it hard.
 
Kidd-7 said:
If you have help look closely at the outer / inner tie rods and the rack bushings while the help wiggles the tire. My rack bushings were so bad the rack shifted laterally about a1/8 inch.
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I will check that next then. The rack bushings do look pretty crunchy and munchy but I didn't think much of it
 
LukesCougar said:
Also im not sure how much side to side play is normal, i cant get the tie rod ends to pop prying or wiggling but i can wiggle the wheel a little on both sides. edit: drivers and passenger side. No up and down play


i look so goofy doing this lol
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Is that with the other wheel on the ground or are you moving both wheels while you’re shakin’ it? If that’s the play on just one side that is beyond excessive, both inner and outer tie rods are shot.
 
XR7-4.6 said:
Is that with the other wheel on the ground or are you moving both wheels while you’re shakin’ it? If that’s the play on just one side that is beyond excessive, both inner and outer tie rods are shot.
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One wheel is on the ground, and the side im wiggling it jacked up

edit, it was still barely touching the ground, just jacked it up enough to wiggle that wheel
 
XR7-4.6 said:
both inner and outer tie rods are shot.
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Are the moog inner/ outers any good? I thought about going with the scp poly kit for the inner/ outers but if i can cheap out here i would considering how much ive spent on the strut rods
 
LukesCougar said:
Are the moog inner/ outers any good? I thought about going with the scp poly kit for the inner/ outers but if i can cheap out here i would considering how much ive spent on the strut rods
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There aren’t bushings in the inner or outers, they are solid ball joints. Moog seems fine, it’s what I used last I did them. The rack mount bushings can be replaced with poly but I’m certain that’s not your problem
 
XR7-4.6 said:
There aren’t bushings in the inner or outers, they are solid ball joints. Moog seems fine, it’s what I used last I did them. The rack mount bushings can be replaced with poly but I’m certain that’s not your problem
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i mean the poly boots for outer tie rods that scp sells with poly for the rack too. "accurate steering package" What brand would their inner/ outer rods be? So i could just find them cheaper
 
LukesCougar said:
i mean the poly boots for outer tie rods that scp sells with poly for the rack too. "accurate steering package" What brand would their inner/ outer rods be? So i could just find them cheaper
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TRW or Moog are the preferred brands, MEVOTECH next, Dorman would be last.

OEM parts were TRW.
 
LukesCougar said:
i mean the poly boots for outer tie rods that scp sells with poly for the rack too. "accurate steering package" What brand would their inner/ outer rods be? So i could just find them cheaper
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Poly tie rod boots are a waste of money IMO, the regular rubber ones are thicker than the ones used in control arm ball joints and in my observation tend to outlast the toe rod ends themselves
 
XR7-4.6 said:
Is that with the other wheel on the ground or are you moving both wheels while you’re shakin’ it? If that’s the play on just one side that is beyond excessive, both inner and outer tie rods are shot.
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I believe you were right. At least for the inners. i cannot tell if the outer is moving but the inner definitely is. Here is a video doing the same side to side movement with the other wheel on the ground.

Shop doesn't seem to think they're bad because they cant get any movement prying on it or at the outer tie rod, and i cant either, but i now see the inners are almost certainly worn

 
also they were able to align the car properly like this.. further aiding in the thought process that theyre good to go, but im sure there is an explanation for the inner rods being worn but still being close enough to spec right? Losing my mind here, but ill assume they just didnt want to mess with it or genuinely believe theyre fine because it was "good enough to align"
 
My inner tie rods had maybe 1/4" - 3/8" of in/out play and definitely needed to be changed when I replaced the front suspension on my 95 XR7. I still have occasional clunks and wish I didn't actually replace the strut-rod bushings.

On your video, the way the bellows dust cover is moving makes me believe your inner tie-rods need to be replaced.

Here's a video of my inner tie-rod replacement
 
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Kurt K said:
Here's a video of my inner tie-rod replacement
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This helps me exponentially if i need to diy, because this shop is probably tired of me at a certain point haha. Id still be driving it there for an alignment
Thank you



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Also, for anyone viewing, this is what I have came to with the important events written down. With your guy's help ofcourse because i have minimal experience with suspension/ steering components. (Excluding the washer scenario because that was just a blatant mess on the shops part) Please excuse the handwriting, but I will provide this info to the shop. They were just as certain as me at one point that the strut rod bushings were causing most if not all the issues, and have declined to do tie rods in the past because they weren't able to get movement prying them, but I am pretty certain and inline with you guys on the issue. I believe xr7, and others have mentioned before that my binding issue would be steering related, and it makes sense but I've had to deal with the strut rod bushings so much that again I was just as certain as them. the tie rod ends, related components were the issue needing fixed (causing the popping and binding with the lower suspension)

I would say most of this is on me for where I choose to do business and being too lazy to get under there myself, but I will shit if I show them this note and videos and they still think the tie rods are good

:rolleyes2:
 
I could feel .1mm play in an inner tie rod; You can't see that move. My mech said I was nuts, but replaced it when I insisted, and that fixed it, lol.
 
Grog6 said:
I could feel .1mm play in an inner tie rod; You can't see that move. My mech said I was nuts, but replaced it when I insisted, and that fixed it, lol.
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exactly how i feel now... smh. i dont get why they wont just fix what i want fixed... worst case im making them money and im crazy but thats fine considering how much the head of the shop bent the knee to ATTEMPT to fix my alignment/ popping issues

edit: well not exactly, my movement is obvious, but this makes me think its even more laughable that they would think this stuff is in my head or not worth fixing
 
Kurt K said:
My inner tie rods had maybe 1/4" - 3/8" of in/out play and definitely needed to be changed when I replaced the front suspension on my 95 XR7. I still have occasional clunks and wish I didn't actually replace the strut-rod bushings.

On your video, the way the bellows dust cover is moving makes me believe your inner tie-rods need to be replaced.

Here's a video of my inner tie-rod replacement
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i also just noticed we have the same setup strut rod wise. oem rears and scp/ energy suspension on the front. or at the least at the time of your filming. I still think they helped me a lot with brake wandering and nose dive
 
LukesCougar said:
i also just noticed we have the same setup strut rod wise. oem rears and scp/ energy suspension on the front. or at the least at the time of your filming. I still think they helped me a lot with brake wandering and nose dive
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I do still have that setup. But I think the OEM front bushings were good enough I should kept them.
 
I have the last set of OEM front bushings, in a box. I got them in ~05, thought they were bad on Lazarus, but they were fine. I put 500k more miles on them.
 
Kurt K said:
I do still have that setup. But I think the OEM front bushings were good enough I should kept them.
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Mine were trashed from fluid/ years of wear and I couldn't find the oem for the fronts sadly
 
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